XCOM 2
Lucubrations Infantry Class
Comments and Criticism
What do you think about the class? Are the Infantry fun to play? Do they have a role in your team? How do they stack up against the other classes and enemies? Any perks you think are too overpowered/underpowered? I'm interested; let me know.
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Great job!
Can I suggest real grenader class? please make new unit that seperates grenader and heavy gunner.

Stats: lowish health, low mobility, damn low aim, decent will.

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Grenader:
x1 - heavy ordnance original

x2 - launch grenade , Salvo*
x3 - heavy ordnance v2 , heavy ordnance v3
x4 - Better demolition , mobility bonus
x5 - volatile mix A , volatile mix B
x6 - Salvo , C4
x7 - Flash grenade , Frag grenader

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Note:
So this grenader is left side long ranged grenader with GRENADE LAUNCHER,
right side close quarter grenader who doesnt have grenade launcher.

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Heavy ordnance v2 : +1 grenade
Heavy ordnance v3 : +2 utility grenade
C4 : range 6, radius big, blows after 1 turn, uses grenade dmg falloff
Better demolition : better demoition that doesnt sucks.
Mobility bonus : 2-4 mobility. To make right side grenader more close quarter orianted
Volatile mix A : +2 tile
Volatile mix B : +2 dmg
Flash grenade : Flash bang+ grenade
Frag grenader : 2 turn cool down frag grenade. limitless. 5 enviroment dmg.
Τελευταία επεξεργασία από Stahp hacking my acc; 26 Φεβ 2016, 1:46
Hey, Deeldo, thanks for your interest. Right now I'm mostly focusing on the Infantry class, but I agree that it feels like the Grenadier needs to be reworked somehow and separated from the gunner.

There's a couple of good places you can go to get your ideas circulating and maybe get some traction from other modders: the Workshop forums, the Nexus mods forums, and the xcom2mods and xdev subreddits are all active modding communities at the moment. You could get some good discussion going there and write up a re-design that modders may get involved with to work on.
Τελευταία επεξεργασία από Divine Lucubration; 26 Φεβ 2016, 8:55
Hey just a quick comment on a couple things for your awesome class. Played it a bit last night on Legend with increased squad size and enemy pod size. I think this class especially complimented those larger team fights.

I'm a bit concerned that Light 'em up might be touch powerful in its current form for a squaddie power but I think that it informs the rest of the class so needs to remain where it is. It perhaps just needs a downside such as reduced mobility/accuracy on your second move if you shoot on your first move.

You said you were still getting a new animation for Flare so I guess you know that's kinda janky as is (although just adding a throw animation to the soldier would be all I think you'd need tbh).

I didn't get that high to actually test it, but Escape and Evade is a neat talent that I think might cause some issues balance-wise. I wonder if there's a way to limit the concealment to a certain amount of time?

And that's all I got really! Kickass job. Oh it might be nice to have like, one other pistol ability in there to give the pistol just a bit more use to the class but besides that A+ job.
Thank you for your feedback, Wizard; that's exactly what I'm looking for. Incidentally, that's exactly how I play: increased squad and enemy pod size on Legendary. :)

I do know that Light 'Em Up is a really powerful baseline stat. It's pretty iconic to the class so I'm not going to rework it entirely. As to maybe applying some penalty on the second shot, I think I'm going to let it ride for a while longer and get more feedback.

I know Flare is not great visually; that's the last thing I'm struggling with right now. Ultimately I'd like to make it throw like a Flashbang, but it's going to take a lot of messing around to see if I can dynamically add an item to the soldier just in time to use with an attack animation like that.

That's a really good idea on Escape and Evade, and should be entirely doable. The talent is supposed to be a means of preventing the Irregular, out on the enemy flank, from getting focused down during the enemy turn without being a total Get Out Of Jail Free card. I definitely didn't want to add a way to get infinite re-concealment during the mission. Making it last just through 1 or "1.5" turns should work perfectly.
Yeah, im also playing with double enemy size yet still with better weapons+attachment makes sqadie infantry way better than my most soldiers. Is it possible to make the second shot -25% aim or something like that?
A thought on Explosive Action. I got it as a hidden skill for my sniper and she became, you know, a god. The sniper class IMO is pretty OP as it is - I mean, a gunslinger with bluescreen can shoot down a sectopod by him/herself with a pistol (?!). With explosive action they can also move and shoot with the rifle - basically snapshot without the penalty. Missing an action later does not really have an impact as they can (as mentioned) unleash tons of damage with one action with the pistol. I haven't got it in any other class but I can see it being OP in conjunction with other skills too (the ones which do not end a turn). A leader could in theory boost aim, crit chances AND shoot or overwatch.The AI is not equipped to deal with this, I think. I'm not sure if it is a matter of removing the skill from AWC or maybe redesigning the skill itself. Maybe making it so it grants certain types of action rather than a full free action. Something like Long War's "ready for anything" (overwatching after shooting). I'm not sure if that is possible and if it is too much work just leave it. Your mod is awesome regardless.
That does sound really powerful on a gunslinger, Nom. I don't as yet feel that the perk is too powerful for in the context of the Infantry class itself (compared to some of the later-tier perks from other classes), so I'm a bit averse to changing it outright. Maybe removing it from the AWC is the right answer.

On a different note, I'm starting to reconsider the tuning of Stick and Move, and perhaps dodge stacking on the Irregular in general.

On the one hand, the potential for stacking 89 dodge in combination with Wraith Armor, PCS: Superior Agility and Escape and Evade seems pretty broken. On the other hand, just 15 or 20 dodge alone isn't that great. It winds up in the weird position of not being strong enough to be useful for thoughtful plays and being too strong, allowing lazy play.

I have the notion of turning Escape and Evade into a mechanically-similar active defense on a moderate cooldown. Stick and Move, maybe just drop the dodge component or turn it into Lightning Reflexes/Shadowstep until the end of the turn.
Just piping in to say I don't think AWC perks are ever necessarily that balanced. Explosive Action might be powerful on sharpshooters, but certainly no more powerful than Death from Above on any non-sharpshooter class. It's probably not really necessary to balance a perk based on what could happen if it pops up on the AWC unless a particular combination is so powerful it would be gamebreaking, which I don't think Explosive Action on a sharpshooter is. They can get a mod on their weapon to give them a 15% chance to get a free action regardless, so an activated ability that does the same at a penalty next round seems perfectly fine.

Dodge seems like a really difficult mechanic to balance around. Making it reliable without making it broken will be really difficult as long as it's tied to a percentage chance. Maybe it would be best to try separating it from a random chance and instead just make it so that it triggers after certain actions such that the next attack against them is a guaranteed dodge like the Ranger skill that makes the next attack on them after a kill auto-miss? Just an idea.
Τελευταία επεξεργασία από A Wizard Did It; 29 Φεβ 2016, 14:21
Or maybe just buff Defense and no_critical_shot against infantry perk?
How about Stagger Shot? Ability: Crits remove one AP from the enemy's current turn (If you shot on your turn, they lose 1 AP next turn, but if you shot on Overwatch, it removes one then and there). \
Everything works after the latest fix. Great mod.
Solid class, fills a good role at medium range. Thank god for the flare change, will have to test it out in the next game. I like the change to stick and move I will be sure to test that as well. The change to Established Defense makes opportunist more competitive with Harrier so that is solid.

Will test out the new escape and evade looks good. I can see both skills on that tier being competitive adding the in the reduced wound modifier really allows for more aggressive play. Its what I wish med kits would do. Fire for Effect is already more useful, I just was never using it before. If you wanted it to feel different given so many line based attacks, you could use a wide cone but meh. Right now I use it when I absolutely need a hit or if I get a line up. It could be a 100% hit and put you into overwatch after to have interplay with the oppurtunist.

I liked zone of control, it filled a similar role as bladestorm but at range. I got a really good ambush out of it. That said with all the other changes it is likely a solid change balance wise given oppurtunist, establish defense and explosive action can allow for four over watch shots if set up. A bladestorm range and a zone of control infantry did make for quick work of rampaging lids... Right now I will likely opt for staggering shot which I like the idea of.

If I was going to adjust Zone of control I would change it to take a pistol shot when an ally was being attacked. Keeps the theme of reaction shots to the tree but not overlapping with opportunist which is on movement.

I have literally never needed to use Shake it Off, it seems useful in theory but my Infantry never seems to be disabled. It might as well just be a passive. If it was on a CD I would want it to remove any negative status effects.

All and all a nice class addition I will keep playing with. Made much better today.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Bxd794dQIMyTbkNzTWRhMG5lZTg/view?usp=sharing

I made translated files for Korean localization.
Can you update it, plz?
Τελευταία επεξεργασία από thunderbeast; 10 Μαρ 2016, 3:58
Yes, thank you, thunderbeast. I will update the mod tonight with localization. I also have a Russian translation that I need to include.
Hi, here is the french localization I've done and use, if you want it. Thanks for your mod, great class.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1n5gCInkzpoOXJRT2VOQy1OWlU/view?usp=sharing
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