Total War: ROME II - Emperor Edition

Total War: ROME II - Emperor Edition

Historic Hellenistic World
Phalangitis  [developer] 28 Aug, 2014 @ 6:01pm
1)unit types
1) In game’s time the Hellenistic world mainly used pikes.In fact pikes became further and further enlarged even reaching 24 feet and the phalangites wore more heavy armor and shields.Some extreamly heavy units created in that time also carrying a hoplon shield strapped in their shoulder (see above the grey pics of a monument in Delphi and pergamon).Experts say it shows a phalangiti armed in hoplon shield).These troops are extreamly slow and volnurable in flanks and rear (possibly the reason for the downfall of Macedonian-type phalanx) but deadly.Usually Pike phalanx consisted of 512 men.I could easily do that but to avoid make the game heavy for low end machines I kept unit size in 256 but i also halved upkeep and recruitment.This also had a fortunate effect that AI finds pike troops more cost effective and enlists more pikes as it should do.Hoplites were very few and a lot different than 4th century.After the invasion of Celts both the way hoplites fought changed also did their equipment and type.Most cities used lighter Iphikratean type of hoplites with leather or spolas armor, thureos shields, longer dory (like lances) and double size swords.These hoplites they could play also a “peltast” -ranged role and they usually fought like pikemen in close combat.Spear infantry of the game (thureos spears,peroiokoi,levy spears etc) are like that.They are light,form pike walls and can throw javelins altogether. Traditional hoplites were as heavy as before but much rarer (bigger costs) and also armed with lances and holding them with one hand.Spartans reformed mainly in pikes but their few hoplites they kept were lightly clothed (with an exomis cloth leaving the right shoulder free for better movement.{see pic nr}.Exception was their heavy troop (In the mod :kings 300,royals,mora skhititae the former heroes of Sparta). Finally they were few troops with a mix of the two extremes equipped with scale and thureos but fighting in the traditional way. Very few sword units existed and only after the phalanx defeat of the battle o Pidna from Legions they slightly appeared later on.Javelinmen have more ammo (9),speed but lighter javs.Peltast use ancyle javs reaching much bigger distances but fewer ammo (7) and speed.
{an exception is Thracian peltasts that are better than normal peltasts both in ammo capacity,representing better killing potential, and also in speed}
Iphicratean troops have the smallest number of ammo (5) and speed but they can form pike phalanx making them extremely useful flank protective troops. Finally there are also Athenian marines here.A land-Iphicratean type of unit but when on sea instead of transport uses trirems.Of course cost and upkeep is that of normal troops plus the cost of trirems so use wisely..and a brand newly made, more flexible Trireme with fire pots and a unit of plain horse archers for Athens left as Scythian on purpose because that they where actualy..
Auxilliaries now are available for all factions representing local troop recruitment (an easy way to make this mod save game compatible and avoid startpos changes).This is done through auxilliery buildings and troops are dressed in their native and not the faction’s colours and the same goes for mercenaries.Barbarians and easterners can recruit fewer types of auxillia.The ones close to their philosophy.E.g Germans can recruit Gauls but not Greek hoplites or Hastati..
Steppe people they dont recruit anyone..
Last edited by Phalangitis; 29 Aug, 2014 @ 5:19am
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Showing 1-15 of 36 comments
Commander Of Men 28 Aug, 2014 @ 7:45pm 
I have a question about the Athenian marines. It sounds like they are a land based unit not a naval one, is that correct? You can mod a land based unit to have a naval vessel when transporting? Maybe I misunderstood you though.
Phalangitis  [developer] 28 Aug, 2014 @ 10:30pm 
yes you can.It is a land unit but when it goes into water it has trirems not transports..
Matrik137 1 Sep, 2014 @ 7:38am 
i was wondering about your decision on unit limits for certain factions. I noticed for example that the hellenic royal gaurds were limited to 4 but the foot companions, silver shields, and bronze shields are all unlimited.
Phalangitis  [developer] 1 Sep, 2014 @ 7:42am 
You are right elite pikes should be limited..It must have slipped my attention.Thanks for pointing out.Anyway Royal troops will be less in numbers than other elite troops.Your name goes into descreption and if you find anything else odd please report..I am only doing it by myself you know no big modding teams here..
Phalangitis  [developer] 1 Sep, 2014 @ 7:49am 
ok made a cap of 12.This is close to 6000 men.It is very close to History.(When Alexander died there where 4-5000 silver shields..).Now also add the potential of making a hudge empire so i think 6,000 men considering the elite training they needed and lack of recruits Hellenistic kingdoms suffered is a logical number.
Matrik137 1 Sep, 2014 @ 11:29am 
You may ave noticed this when you were adjusting the caps on the elite units, but you also have the citizen hoplites and militia hoplites capped at 1.

Also, I don't know if you have had this issue in mods, but when I was experimenting with unit caps for my own mods, it seemed that the troops making up a garrison army also contributed to the unit cap, this easily could have been my own error though.
Last edited by Matrik137; 1 Sep, 2014 @ 11:29am
Phalangitis  [developer] 1 Sep, 2014 @ 11:54am 
you are right but those troops are not used as garrisons.Militia and citizen only and thats why i used a cap of 1 to be ade only garrison troops.This gives two benefits.1) the AI is forced to enlist better troops and not armies of citizen hoplites and 2) hoplites where rare that time in history already
Matrik137 1 Sep, 2014 @ 12:14pm 
I had a feeling that's why you did that, and I think it is a good idea. However, some higher level buildings use regular hoplites, which you have limited to 6, and i know sparta uses periokoi hoplites as garrions and those are limited to 10.
Phalangitis  [developer] 1 Sep, 2014 @ 12:17pm 
now all these might change from the new patch.I am downloading and will react accordingly.For a few days dont upgrade to patch 15..
Matrik137 1 Sep, 2014 @ 9:53pm 
one last thing i noticed aside from the unit limits, when i was trying out some battle situations with the pike units, i would charge the parthian royal catapracts directly into the rear of a pike formation with trample turned on while the pike formation was engaging a melee unit in the front, and the pikemen, the foot companions in this case, lost only 5-7 men consistently on the charge from the cataphracts. This seemed like a very low number considering the situation.
Phalangitis  [developer] 1 Sep, 2014 @ 11:02pm 
Pikes have a great number of mass to represent their big number and weight.So at first during the charge they may loose fewer men than more light formations..They are extreamly weak in close combat though so charging them after a small weakening with missiles or using melee type of troops like agema cavalry or sword units will destroy them after the first initial resist of the shock.Anyway i plan to balance better but to do so i must first manage to load and i need to first make it compatible to patch 15...Thanks for all this tips you are going to be mentioned as a game tester in the mod description keep up the good work and read the new description !!!
Matrik137 2 Sep, 2014 @ 8:24am 
Thanks for the mention. I think this is a great mod and I will keep testing it and posting my suggestions if you like?
Phalangitis  [developer] 2 Sep, 2014 @ 8:44am 
of course i like and thank you in advance..
Matrik137 2 Sep, 2014 @ 9:20am 
maybe you already though of this, but I had one idea about achieving the unit recruitment limitations you are aiming for without dealing with the garrisons. I don't know how much work this would take, but you could find out what units you wish to limit are garrison troops and duplicate those units. Then limit the garrison version to 1 like you did with the militia and citizen hoplites and set the new duplicate unit to your desired limit and make them recruitable.
Phalangitis  [developer] 2 Sep, 2014 @ 9:38am 
yes i thought about it but i did not proceed with that idea because noone needs militia and citizen hoplites..Especialy when you can have thureos hoplites (which are also more historic).If we where in classic Greece that would be a difinite thing that i should do but in Hellenistic era..Also the AI will start recruiting them again and even with measures i took that dont alow AI to recruit junk troops sometimes it finds them cost effective and recruits them anyway..I can increase the cost but then it would brake game balance.Imagine a militia costing more than an expert unit..
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