Originally posted by Pte Jack:

Originally posted by Zappy:

It doesn't stop you from importing or exporting DMX models with more than 3 bone links per vertex for Source 1 games, for example.

It doesn't?? Any time I have a model that has over 3 influences and I try to export it, BleST will throw a "Warning" and not do it until I either cull out the influences on a DMX export or fix the influences on a SMD export by limiting the number or deleting the overages. If I decompile a Valve model and import it, there aren't any influences over 3. -

No, it doesn't. (The Blender Source Tools will give you a warning on export, but still lets you export it. StudioMDL itself will prohibit you from compiling models using DMX meshes with more than 3 bone links for a vertex, however.)

Originally posted by Pte Jack:

- I ported this Batman model that has 207 in it - The resulting Valve model ended up with 171 - I used Crowbar to decompiled the MDL/VTX/VVD combination - and reimported the decompiled SMD files back into Blender using BleST. - The only "non"- problem I had was BleST "warning" me that SMD Format does not support over 128 bones, but the model imported correctly, all 171 bones are there and weightpainted correctly.

If that's the case, then Usagimi has just used the word "error" instead of "warning" while never mentioning that the model actually imported, which made me think that it was an error and not a warning. In that case, I'm unsure whether the fault lies with Usagimi or me.

Originally posted by Pte Jack:

You have to remember that the SMD format has been around forever -Snipped to keep the quote short-

I know, but that's no reason to actually prevent people from importing and/or exporting SMD models that are still completely valid syntax-wise. It doesn't stop you from importing or exporting DMX models with more than 3 bone links per vertex for Source 1 games, for example.

And again...

Originally posted by Pte Jack:

- We need a decompiler that will actually create a DMX source model, -

Exactly. We don't have one, so we instead get DMX -> VTX(?) -> SMD, and if the DMX has more than 128 bones, the Source engine model will too, and so will the decompiled SMD, and then the Blender Source Tools can't import the SMD, because it has over 128 bones and Source doesn't suppor that, despite there being no bone amount restriction in the SMD format itself. There's not really any reason to prohibit that (unless there are, like, over 2^32 bones or something like that, or something else that Blender itself doesn't support).

In other words, provided the SMD importing is coded in a "dynamic" way (checking the amount of bones in the SMD rather than using a hardcoded 128 value), the only thing that would really have to be done is remove the stuff that says "if there are more than 128 bones, give and error and don't import it". (The same might go for exporting.) And if a hardcoded value is used, increasing it to at least should be enough.


Note that when I'm saying the Blender Source Tools aren't importing it, I'm presuming that based on Usagimi using the word "error", not "warning", while an error is something not being able to be done while a warning is just some "hey, you should know this" kind of stuff.

Originally posted by Usagimi:

thing is when i decompile with crowbar i get smd files -
when i import the qc it gave the bone error and model has around 200 bones -

If what Pte Jack implies is true (SMD meshes can't have more than 128 bones, while DMX meshes can have 256), it's possible that the original model used DMX meshes when being compiled. There's just currently no Source engine model decompiler that generates DMX meshes, only SMD meshes, which means something along the lines of this being the process:

DMX > StudioMDL (model compiler) > Source engine model > Crowbar (model decompiler) > SMD
(Again, with DMX supporting 256 bones, but SMD only supporting 128 bones.)



Though if the Blender Source Tools can't import SMD meshes with more than 128 bones, I'd say that that's probably not so good behaviour; In my opinion, it would be better for it to import and export SMD meshes without a fuss, but give a warning if exporting a SMD mesh with more than 128 bones (but still import such SMD meshes without a fuss, and also still export them).

The SMD mesh format itself isn't technically restricted in such a way, so putting such a restriction on a SMD importer/exporter seems fairly silly to me.

Originally posted by theRPGmaster:

Some parts of my model still ignores my texture / usues vanilla texure. -Image-

If the rest of the model uses a pure white texture, then those bits of the model are using a different ("vanilla") material and texture instead, which is (almost definitely) just human error on your part, not Blender Source Tools'.

How many bones does the armature(/bone skeleton) have?

Originally posted by Pte Jack:

Have fun with all those doubles and separated triangles then.

Why? The latest version of the Blender Source Tools uses a modifier to apply the custom normals to a doubles-removed mesh, as far as I'm aware judging by some recent-ish discussions on the Blender Source Tools Steam forum, I think. (Unless that hasn't been released yet.)

Originally posted by Pte Jack:

-Image-

In that case, it seems to have something to do with the "remove doubles" thing the non-"Preserve SMD Polygons & Normals" SMD import mode does. Which is probably helpful for Artfunkel to know, but also means it might not be quite as easily fixable as any of us might like.

Originally posted by Pte Jack:

Preserve Polygon and normals are unchecked in both the SMD and DMX imports

It won't matter for DMX. Though I wasn't asking "do you have it enabled or disabled", but rather "does it happen when it's disabled, and does it happen when it's enabled".

I'm not quite sure (the first Gif you linked to is too non-single-image-y for me to tell), but I believe that the DMX import of the Demoman looks just like I remember it shading-wise.

Edit: Also, as for the SMD problem, does this apply to having "Preserve SMD Polygons & Normals" checked, un-checked, or both?

Originally posted by Edward:

Well, until a solution is found and added to the next update, I can only think of 3 workarounds... Try to force Double-Sided rendering, find all flipped normals and flip them manually, or use an older version of Blender to import the models then work on them in the newer version.

What about importing the mesh with "Preserve SMD Polygons & Normals" disabled, then selecting the whole mesh and using "recalculate normals" (or something like that)? I believe that should automatically try to figure out what is "outwards" and then make all faces face that way.