Team Fortress 2

Team Fortress 2

The Blademaster
Stat Discussion
Come on, it's Silver Chariot.
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Showing 1-15 of 27 comments
This weapon has a long melee range and deploys and holsters slower
While weapon is active:
50% faster firing speed
20% faster movement speed on wearer
-30% damage penalty
25% faster cloak drain rate
Stogie 8 May, 2022 @ 7:36am 
Originally posted by Delila:
This weapon has a long melee range and deploys and holsters slower
While weapon is active:
50% faster firing speed
20% faster movement speed on wearer
-30% damage penalty
25% faster cloak drain rate

I much prefer the stats suggested by Spike Nitro. The lack of a long melee range forces Spy to use his parry to get in against Demoknights, adding a fun dynamic between the two.

One detail I think this weapon COULD benefit from is a way to get out after securing a kill, akin to Demoman's charge. My suggestion:

On kill: 20% faster movement speed on wearer for 2.5 seconds.

This allows Spy to move as fast as a Scout for a few moments after each kill, ensuring he can either close gaps or get to cover. When coupled with the ambassador, a skilled Spy could alternate between headshots and finishing blows, allowing him to lunge between targets.
Until he runs into a Pyro, Heavy, or sentry, of course. Just like Demoknight.
Originally posted by Stogie:
Originally posted by Delila:
This weapon has a long melee range and deploys and holsters slower
While weapon is active:
50% faster firing speed
20% faster movement speed on wearer
-30% damage penalty
25% faster cloak drain rate

I much prefer the stats suggested by Spike Nitro. The lack of a long melee range forces Spy to use his parry to get in against Demoknights, adding a fun dynamic between the two.

One detail I think this weapon COULD benefit from is a way to get out after securing a kill, akin to Demoman's charge. My suggestion:

On kill: 20% faster movement speed on wearer for 2.5 seconds.

This allows Spy to move as fast as a Scout for a few moments after each kill, ensuring he can either close gaps or get to cover. When coupled with the ambassador, a skilled Spy could alternate between headshots and finishing blows, allowing him to lunge between targets.
Until he runs into a Pyro, Heavy, or sentry, of course. Just like Demoknight.
That's just the Big Earner
Kitten 8 May, 2022 @ 1:01pm 
+25 or 30 Melee range
-15 Swinging speed

I mean, it's a long sword, it would only make sense to have some melee range.
But the slower swinging speed is so that Spy cannot chain stab every distant enemy
Last edited by Kitten; 8 May, 2022 @ 1:03pm
Stogie 8 May, 2022 @ 2:46pm 
Originally posted by Delila:
Originally posted by Stogie:

I much prefer the stats suggested by Spike Nitro. The lack of a long melee range forces Spy to use his parry to get in against Demoknights, adding a fun dynamic between the two.

One detail I think this weapon COULD benefit from is a way to get out after securing a kill, akin to Demoman's charge. My suggestion:

On kill: 20% faster movement speed on wearer for 2.5 seconds.

This allows Spy to move as fast as a Scout for a few moments after each kill, ensuring he can either close gaps or get to cover. When coupled with the ambassador, a skilled Spy could alternate between headshots and finishing blows, allowing him to lunge between targets.
Until he runs into a Pyro, Heavy, or sentry, of course. Just like Demoknight.
That's just the Big Earner

What the heck are you talking about? One's a knife that makes you extremely fragile but better at chainstabbing, the other is a rapier that forces you to face enemies head-on. Just because they both grant speed boosts doesn't make them identical. That's like saying the Sandvich and Dalakhos bar are the same.
Originally posted by Stogie:

What the heck are you talking about? One's a knife that makes you extremely fragile but better at chainstabbing, the other is a rapier that forces you to face enemies head-on. Just because they both grant speed boosts doesn't make them identical. That's like saying the Sandvich and Dalakhos bar are the same.
Were you suggesting that the speed boost on backstab be added to my original idea or that it would be a replacement to something else in my idea? I guess I didn't know what exactly you were getting at and just seeing a speed boost on backstab made the think that it would be the same thing.
Stogie 9 May, 2022 @ 7:14am 
Originally posted by Delila:
Originally posted by Stogie:

What the heck are you talking about? One's a knife that makes you extremely fragile but better at chainstabbing, the other is a rapier that forces you to face enemies head-on. Just because they both grant speed boosts doesn't make them identical. That's like saying the Sandvich and Dalakhos bar are the same.
Were you suggesting that the speed boost on backstab be added to my original idea or that it would be a replacement to something else in my idea? I guess I didn't know what exactly you were getting at and just seeing a speed boost on backstab made the think that it would be the same thing.

Did you see the stats suggested by the item's creator, inside the images for this item? I'm suggesting the speed boost be added to those. So the item would only minicrit on a backstab, and use cloak to parry instead of turn invisible.
Originally posted by Stogie:
Originally posted by Delila:
Were you suggesting that the speed boost on backstab be added to my original idea or that it would be a replacement to something else in my idea? I guess I didn't know what exactly you were getting at and just seeing a speed boost on backstab made the think that it would be the same thing.

Did you see the stats suggested by the item's creator, inside the images for this item? I'm suggesting the speed boost be added to those. So the item would only minicrit on a backstab, and use cloak to parry instead of turn invisible.
No I hadn't seen it. Regardless, the point of these threads is for us to come up with our own ideas.
David_Sh 9 May, 2022 @ 10:16am 
Originally posted by Delila:
Originally posted by Stogie:

Did you see the stats suggested by the item's creator, inside the images for this item? I'm suggesting the speed boost be added to those. So the item would only minicrit on a backstab, and use cloak to parry instead of turn invisible.
No I hadn't seen it. Regardless, the point of these threads is for us to come up with our own ideas.
yh but when our own ideas are boring, what then?
Last edited by David_Sh; 9 May, 2022 @ 10:17am
Originally posted by David_Sh:
Originally posted by Delila:
No I hadn't seen it. Regardless, the point of these threads is for us to come up with our own ideas.
yh but when our own ideas are boring, what then?
Try to come up with better ones? That's the point of a discussion.
Originally posted by Delila:
This weapon has a long melee range and deploys and holsters slower
While weapon is active:
50% faster firing speed
20% faster movement speed on wearer
-30% damage penalty
25% faster cloak drain rate

For starters, I don’t get the get the faster clock drain rate. You put that as an attribute applied while the weapon is active, meaning you could simply switch to your pistol or sapper while you’re cloaked and completely bypass the downside. As for the damage penalty, I don’t think it’s a practical downside in general, and certainly not one that justifies the two positive attributes. The knife is not generally used to deal regular damage, but rather to perform a backstab for an instant kill. Almost all of the time that you deal regular damage with the knife is when you miss a backstab and hit them normally instead. After that, a player is usually just going to cloak and escape or pull out their revolver to finish them off. And in the case that you included that stat to affect backstabs, a 30% damage reduction still leaves way more than enough damage to kill a fully overheated target of any class. The 20% movement speed also doesn’t make much sense. Spy is already tied with medic as the second fastest class in the game, and having a 20% passive speed boost whenever you are carrying around what is essentially your primary weapon would make you just a tiny bit slower than a scout. This, combined with the increased melee range, would be absolutely insanely overpowered as the only effective downside the weapon would have is the slower deploy and holster speed. Then there’s the issue of the faster firing speed. The bat, the fastest stock melee in the game, attacks at roughly 0.5 seconds between swings. The fastest melee in the game, being the eviction notice, is only around 0.02 seconds faster. Both of these weapons are balanced to effectively counter the firing speed by having low damage, and in the case of the eviction notice, health drain. The stock knife has an attack interval of about 0.8 seconds. Increasing the attack speed by 50% gives it an attack interval of about 0.4 seconds, making it the fastest melee weapon in the game. Applied to a weapon with increased reach that can instantly kill any enemy as long as it hits the rear 180 degrees of their hit box. Also worth mentioning is that the damage of the stock bat is 35. With an attack interval of 0.5 seconds between swings, it deals 70 DPS. The damage of the stock knife is 40. Reducing this by 30% leaves it at 28. But with an attack interval of 0.4 seconds between stabs, the DPS is also 70, making it effectively a direct upgrade to the stock bat with an extended range and the aforementioned ability to instantly kill any ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ class when you hit the back half of their hitbox. And since you also have basically the same speed as a scout, the only difference between a spy using the weapon and a scout using his melee is the ability to double jump. These stats make literally no sense if you take even two minutes to actually think about them.
Originally posted by mukewaz:
Originally posted by Delila:
This weapon has a long melee range and deploys and holsters slower
While weapon is active:
50% faster firing speed
20% faster movement speed on wearer
-30% damage penalty
25% faster cloak drain rate

For starters, I don’t get the get the faster clock drain rate. You put that as an attribute applied while the weapon is active, meaning you could simply switch to your pistol or sapper while you’re cloaked and completely bypass the downside. As for the damage penalty, I don’t think it’s a practical downside in general, and certainly not one that justifies the two positive attributes. The knife is not generally used to deal regular damage, but rather to perform a backstab for an instant kill. Almost all of the time that you deal regular damage with the knife is when you miss a backstab and hit them normally instead. After that, a player is usually just going to cloak and escape or pull out their revolver to finish them off. And in the case that you included that stat to affect backstabs, a 30% damage reduction still leaves way more than enough damage to kill a fully overheated target of any class. The 20% movement speed also doesn’t make much sense. Spy is already tied with medic as the second fastest class in the game, and having a 20% passive speed boost whenever you are carrying around what is essentially your primary weapon would make you just a tiny bit slower than a scout. This, combined with the increased melee range, would be absolutely insanely overpowered as the only effective downside the weapon would have is the slower deploy and holster speed. Then there’s the issue of the faster firing speed. The bat, the fastest stock melee in the game, attacks at roughly 0.5 seconds between swings. The fastest melee in the game, being the eviction notice, is only around 0.02 seconds faster. Both of these weapons are balanced to effectively counter the firing speed by having low damage, and in the case of the eviction notice, health drain. The stock knife has an attack interval of about 0.8 seconds. Increasing the attack speed by 50% gives it an attack interval of about 0.4 seconds, making it the fastest melee weapon in the game. Applied to a weapon with increased reach that can instantly kill any enemy as long as it hits the rear 180 degrees of their hit box. Also worth mentioning is that the damage of the stock bat is 35. With an attack interval of 0.5 seconds between swings, it deals 70 DPS. The damage of the stock knife is 40. Reducing this by 30% leaves it at 28. But with an attack interval of 0.4 seconds between stabs, the DPS is also 70, making it effectively a direct upgrade to the stock bat with an extended range and the aforementioned ability to instantly kill any ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ class when you hit the back half of their hitbox. And since you also have basically the same speed as a scout, the only difference between a spy using the weapon and a scout using his melee is the ability to double jump. These stats make literally no sense if you take even two minutes to actually think about them.
I'm not reading all that
Your loss. It only takes a minute to read, but I suppose that’s too long for you to think about something considering how little thought went into your proposed stats.
Originally posted by mukewaz:
Your loss. It only takes a minute to read, but I suppose that’s too long for you to think about something considering how little thought went into your proposed stats.
Cope
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