Team Fortress 2

Team Fortress 2

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Anti-Trickstab Training
By Warren
Getting annoyed with how BS Spies can be sometimes? Learn the correct way of dispatching these cretins.
   
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Introduction
The Spy can be a powerful asset in the hands of someone who is familiar with the game engine and how the game handles hitboxes. But just because someone knows how the stairstab works it doesn't mean they're infallable - if they can't remain unpredictable and dangerous they're no better than a trained monkey.

What on earth is a trickstab and why should I care?
A trickstab is the term used for taking advantage of the games very generous backstab hitboxes. Look at the diagram, the red circle is you and the line going through you represents where your backstab hitboxes begin and end. It is this hitbox that the Spy needs to aim for by baiting his victim into either chasing or meleeing him.

There are various ways this can be done and there are as many ways for ruining their fun. I'll list each possible attack and provide a counter-strategy (and you don't even need to switch to Pyro!)

Sounds cool? OK!
The ONYD Range & You
I don't feel this guide will be OTT enough without coining a silly phrase of my own, and that will be 'Oh No You Don't' (ONYD) range. I'm going to be using this term a lot in this guide because if fighting one of these guys hasn't already taught you not to give them a hug, you need it spelled out.

If you see the spy or you see through his disguise and he isn't already fleeing, it means he wants to bait you into exposing your hitboxes. If that's the case don't oblige him and melee him (1), this is the range the trickstab Spy wants. Instead strafe and use a close-range attack weapon (2). This tells him that you're aware of his plot and he can either flee and try again later, set you up for another trickstab or die an idiot's death.

The reason I'm putting this in it's own section is because this is the golden rule: STAY AT ONYD RANGE AT ALL TIMES WHEN BATTLING A TRICKSTABBER! No exceptions. As I said above; the trickstabber is working on the basis that you'll try and melee him or even get near him for long enough for him to exploit your own position.
The Trickstabs
These are the most common stabs you will encounter, and ONYD range applies to all of them.

The Stairstab
What it is: The infamous stairstab, so-called the stairstab because when you're chasing a Spy up some stairs or a ramp he will leap over your head and score a cheap backstab. Don't forget that this can also apply to ANY elevation advantage, so if a part of the map goes up slightly or the spy is sitting on a dispenser, the same thing will happen.
Counter it by: Follow the Spy up the damn stairs (it's what he wants) but at ONYD range. As soon as you see those feet leave the floor MOVE BACK and aim at him. Got it? BACK UP BUT AIM AT THE SPY! Nine times out of ten he will land right in front of you and will look very stupid... You on the other hand will still be in ONYD range. He will not have a hope in hell in retreating if you're playing a high-damage class or if your team happens to be around.

The Cornerstab
What it is: Again, you're persuing a Spy and you go to turn a corner. Suddenly, backstabs. Why? Because when you're turning the position of your hitboxes are moving around with you, the Spy knows this and simply telegraphed when and how you'd be taking the corner.
Counter it by: Strafe along the corner or bait the spy into moving in for the cornerstab and back up to ONYD range. Either he'll keep trying and risk drawing more attention to himself or leave you alone.

The Quickstab
What it is: Two people walk past each other, one a Spy and the other his victim. The Spy quickly turns around and quickly backstabs the victim. Simple, but that's why it is so called the quickstab - it's quick.
Counter it by: Most players on your team will either deliberately or unknowingly walk through you on several occassions. A spy doing the same thing wouldn't work so they walk slightly off center to avoid bumping into you. If you see a friendly player moving your way but not intentionally walking through you just be on the safe side and spycheck with a ranged weapon. If they look at you or try to avoid the interaction, they're most likely a spy. Spycheck them at ONYD range and if they flee up some stairs or round a corner then they are trying to bait you into the above two trickstabs respectively (see above).

The Matador / Facestab
What it is: A spy with the knowledge on how to pull this trickstab is dangerous and the entire reason I am coining ONYD range as my own. The facestab or matador stab is all about exploiting that hitbox in a melee fight and close range.
Counter it by: A Spy that has been confronted and knows how to pull one of these off is not someone you want to melee. But here's the trick: He wants YOU to make the first move - always. When you run towards him he is going to turn back around and hit your back. If you deny him the satisfaction of not wanting to go first and ONYD, what's he going to do? Move closer? No of course not. Don't move in close to him, don't chase him up stairs or around corners and just keep lay down hits at constant ONYD range.

As for the other stabs like the leaping stab or the understab these trcikstabs work on using the map geometry more than exploiting hitboxes so there's not much you can do except remain alert, listen to footfalls and fall damaging players, stuff like that.
Now that you've read this...
If this has helped you please pass it on. Knowledge is power and it is better for everyone to build up a resistance to trickstabs. A trickstabber confronted with someone armed with foresight or even the slightest idea of what he's up to is gonna have to work harder at the very least.

Again, pass it on, spread the word. Thank you for reading.
85 Comments
Kyaing of Caprinia 1 Sep, 2023 @ 10:11am 
based guide mister bunny man
Warren  [author] 11 Oct, 2020 @ 4:04am 
@serverus no? also good job picking up and reading a guide i made 5 years ago, but to be honest this guide might be horribly out of date. For all I know, they've changed the ridiculous hitbox detection, or changed how hitboxes are registered, or spies might have come up with a new trickstab i'm not aware of. Who knows?

But one thing I do remember is when I wrote this guide, I wasn't having trouble with spies or getting trickstabbed. I simply had some insight on the patterns they were using, wrote them down and published them for people to maybe learn something. So your "lol you mad" comment isn't even valid. Nice try.
⦻woodland whisperer⦻ 10 Oct, 2020 @ 3:16am 
hahahah this guy got owned by a spy main and rage created this guide ahahahaahahahahaha
Joani 6 Jan, 2019 @ 2:36am 
Just saying i remember once i was pyro chasing a spy up the ledge of badwater basin and i suddenly just drink a sip of cola and stop for a second and at the ledge he did a blind stairstab but to his avail there is no pyro and im just standing at his side. R.I.P. spy you won't be missed
Warren  [author] 7 Nov, 2014 @ 3:52pm 
daepicguyoepic Oh yeah, one more thing. If a spy uses a dead ringer your head count for the eyelander will not go down. A DR spy can nail 2 heads if you play your cards right. Good stuff...
Warren  [author] 7 Nov, 2014 @ 3:50pm 
@daepicguyoepic you need not worry, using a sword for demoman has a larger melee range than stock, which actually deters most spies from attempting a trickstab. So collect heads to your hearts content. Just be wary of stairstabs and cornerstabs because it's unlikely they'll attempt a risky facestab unless they're very confident.
Tourist 3 Nov, 2014 @ 10:07pm 
Oh, yeah, I just want to throw this in so you know what you're up against with trickstabbers who know you're avoiding them:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pqaul3QS03s

Watch your back; C2C is not very common and can be very surprising. I'd suggest standing still and waiting for the Spy to come around the corner is one of the best methods to dealing with this, but you're not giving yourself enough time to react anyway and opening yourself up to shots from the revolver. It's difficult to get away from, but not impossible. (Again, coming from a Spy main. :3
Khorps 27 Oct, 2014 @ 6:39pm 
Pyros my main. Thanks :D
Espurr 404 26 Oct, 2014 @ 9:03pm 
Pro spies and pyros can be some of the scariest people you'll meet on the battlefield.
Tourist 25 Oct, 2014 @ 11:48pm 
Sweet basic knowledge that any TF2 player should know. Great job!

Add a codicil though: Some Spies will trick you into thinking that you're running away. Then they'll get you when you think they're most vulnerable. Some know you're avoiding stabs, so they'll just find another way to trick you. Know that some times, they'll stab you regardless, so you'll still go down. Don't let it bother you, keep hunting them!

Funny thing is, this is coming from a Spy main and trickstabbing fan. :3