Valve is aware of ARM based Mac's.

Originally posted by Snakub Plissken:

Valve is aware of ARM based Mac's.

I wonder what really small amount of the 2.62% that is.

Never say never, but it is a big hurdle.

Overcoming that on the Linux side was something that Valve wanted to do, it was still an x86 target and Wine was something that Proton could be built upon. Adding the whole complexity of an ARM target, a bespoke graphics architecture and APIs seems a step to far for Valve.

Probably less than half a percent of the Mac people on Steam are ARM based. I wouldn't hold out much hope, you might get a client but the catalogue of games will be minimal to say the least.

Originally posted by Mr. Gentlebot:

I wonder what really small amount of the 2.62% that is.

Originally posted by Guru Meditation:

Probably less than half a percent of the Mac people on Steam are ARM based.

It's actually 35.95%, and increasing every month: https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/processormfg/ "VirtualApple" means an Apple Silicon CPU pretending to be an x86_64 CPU via Rosetta.

Originally posted by aiusepsi:

Originally posted by Mr. Gentlebot:

I wonder what really small amount of the 2.62% that is.

Originally posted by Guru Meditation:

Probably less than half a percent of the Mac people on Steam are ARM based.

It's actually 35.95%, and increasing every month: https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/processormfg/ "VirtualApple" means an Apple Silicon CPU pretending to be an x86_64 CPU via Rosetta.

So 35% of 2.62% of total OS usage, being 0.917%
https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey

Originally posted by aiusepsi:

Originally posted by Mr. Gentlebot:

I wonder what really small amount of the 2.62% that is.

Originally posted by Guru Meditation:

Probably less than half a percent of the Mac people on Steam are ARM based.

It's actually 35.95%, and increasing every month: https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/processormfg/ "VirtualApple" means an Apple Silicon CPU pretending to be an x86_64 CPU via Rosetta.

More than I thought. Yes Rosetta is great however I'd tread cautiously of being overly reliant on that as an ongoing feature. Right now during the transition period Apple are happy to give die space to make the feature performant enough, that doesn't mean they'll want it there once all the big apps have ARM ports. Things like VKD3D and DXVK will need to go through a Metal layer or get Metal ports, Wine and Proton would need porting too.

I'm all for an ARM client and even a Mac one. I might not like Mac OS but an ARM version could be useful for other OS's in future, I just doubt Valve see the point right now.

Not gonna happen , Valve will just drop MacOS support .

Originally posted by Guru Meditation:

Originally posted by aiusepsi:

It's actually 35.95%, and increasing every month: https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/processormfg/ "VirtualApple" means an Apple Silicon CPU pretending to be an x86_64 CPU via Rosetta.

More than I thought.

That's because it isn't 35.95%. They're looking at the percentage of which OSX processor type it is, not as a whole. Each, of the windows/osx/linux comes to 100%.

Originally posted by  KARR™:

That's because it isn't 35.95%. They're looking at the percentage of which OSX processor type it is, not as a whole.

Yeah, because I was replying to people saying: "I wonder what really small amount of the 2.62% that is." and "Probably less than half a percent of the Mac people on Steam are ARM based."

It's not half a percent of the Mac people on Steam who are ARM based, it's 35.95%. The small amount of the 2.62% that are, is 35.95%. The context was important.

Originally posted by Guru Meditation:

More than I thought. Yes Rosetta is great however I'd tread cautiously of being overly reliant on that as an ongoing feature. Right now during the transition period Apple are happy to give die space to make the feature performant enough, that doesn't mean they'll want it there once all the big apps have ARM ports.

Maybe; IIRC, the only thing they really need on die to make Rosetta performant is the ability to switch on a mode in the CPU for strong memory ordering to match x86_64's memory semantics. Emulating that in software is possible with sync barriers but would suuuuuuck. I'm not nearly enough of an expert to know how much carrying that hurts space on die, but...

Things like VKD3D and DXVK will need to go through a Metal layer or get Metal ports, Wine and Proton would need porting too.

That's nothing specific to ARM on Mac, the same applies to Intel. It's orthogonal to the CPU architecture.

I might not like Mac OS but an ARM version could be useful for other OS's in future, I just doubt Valve see the point right now.

Personally, I suspect the cost of doing an ARM port of Steam, to any OS, is fairly minimal. Much of Steam and Valve's general codebase that's shared across all their stuff has been ported to multiple architectures already, including ARM. The fragment of Steam which is open source, gamenetworkingsockets, compiles for ARM no problem at all.

For what it's worth, I work at a major retailer. This last quarter I was the number 5 PC sales employee out of 100,000, top 5 in memberships, and over 2,000,000 in sales. Take that for what it's worth, but I am deeply entrenched in the PC market/trends/bleeding edge/future.

We used to sell 10 pcs a day and 1 Mac a week. I'm sorry to say, but we now sell 10 Macs a day at most of our stores, and 1 or 2 pcs a day. It has flipped, and with Intel and Microsoft being 10 years behind now (and the 18 horrible mistakes Microsoft has made over the last year), those of you saying Mac is a small percentage and not the future are dead wrong.

Being in the trenches (previously in Microcsoft's home town at that) we see it daily. We even see the Microsoft reps coming in and talking under the breath about how they are going to compete with Apple. The days of Microsoft are numbered, and Gabe knows this. Just ask Mr. Windows 11 (aka I copied Mac OS because I'm terrified).

Originally posted by Galactic Squid:

We used to sell 10 pcs a day and 1 Mac a week. I'm sorry to say, but we now sell 10 Macs a day at most of our stores, and 1 or 2 pcs a day.

I’m very positive about the switch but there’s no way this is true. I doubt that there’s an even number of sales let alone a 10:1 ratio. Stuff doesn’t go from one Mac sale a week to 10 a day.

может быть проблема не в этом

Originally posted by Galactic Squid:

We used to sell 10 pcs a day and 1 Mac a week. I'm sorry to say, but we now sell 10 Macs a day at most of our stores, and 1 or 2 pcs a day. It has flipped

I believe this especially after looking at Apples returns from Silicon the past few quarters. Massive gains.

"50% of Customers Purchasing a Mac in Q2 2022 Were New Mac Users. Since the launch of the first Apple silicon Macs in November 2020, Apple has continued to see strong growth in Mac sales. Apple's Mac revenue hit $10.4 billion in Q2 2022, up from $9.1 billion in the year-ago quarter." And then factor in Apple's commitments to gaming on Silicon from the last WWDC.

The market is flipping and I even was on the verge of going back to PC permanently until last years refresh.

We may get an M1 optimized app after all and much more if sales continue.

They did update Steam with some ARM binaries Sep 15 2021. Note that it's not the Steam client itself that is yet native but the overlay but it certainly makes things easier for the developers. Now they can deliver Apple Silicon native games on Steam too without separate launchers or other fixes.

Now 41.44% of Mac users on Steam use Apple Silicon. It's a matter of time before we get a fully native ARM client.

https://gtm.steamproxy.vip/groups/steamworks/announcements/detail/2984186817523157399
https://youtu.be/X5uCc1BJGX0